Never Ending Story... Prelude race car build.

[Buzzonion Vtec]

Update 13 – Originally Posted - Thu Nov 26, 2009 9:48 pm

http://preludeuk.forumup.com/viewtopic. ... =preludeuk


Ok this is what you wanted right... a massive list of all the progress of the now surely almost complete car !!


Errrrr sorry to disappoint


In fairness the progress has been rather errr slow to say the least.
Lots of the usual excuses such as Nippon race weekends, working all hours and needing to have some occasional down time from the workshop to recharge the batteries have meant slow progress. That coupled with lots of very time consuming tasks that really aren't of enough interest to warrant taking pics of have meant that if you stand back and look at the car now it doesn't look very much different to the last update .

Anyway, onwards and upwards...lets get bang up to date.


So following on from the last update here's a few pics of the car over the Rally Day event weekend.



On the trailer ready for it's first public outing - "Rally Day" at Castle Combe





Coupled up to the tow barge







The Performance Autoworks "Rally Day" stand.
Race Lude in the build process, Kris' race winning Civic and Dave's mint retro Lancer Turbo - all three cars getting good attention and feedback throughout the day.








Safely back at the workshop unharmed. It was a lovely sunny day on the Sunday after the event so decided it would be a nice chance to get the car outside for a few pictures. The sun really brought out the depth of colour not only in the PAW orange but also the metalic grey.



















[imghttp://img10.imageshack.us/img10/545/buildup55.jpg][/img]









With that done and out of my system I needed to get back on with the build up process.
Now as I've said all along I am not going to rush this and simply bolt everything back on and get the thing ready to use, everything that goes back together is being cleaned, modified, lightened or replaced with more suitable items. This attitude to the build and the time taken to prepare these parts doesn't do any favours for the build up though as I very rarely get big chunks of time spare to spend solely on the race car build. Hopefully the winter will see more available free time and much faster progress.

First up was to get the side skirts back on...

After much consideration as to how to mount the "Euro kit" side skirts and properly support them it was decided that the best effective solution in terms of ease, neatness and weight would be to re-use the original full length plastic side skirts. I looked at making several mounting brackets to do the job but in the end decided to go with the OEM sill covers but there's some modifications to be done first.







This pic shows how much lower the "Euro Kit" skirts sit compared to OEM sill cover. This may well cause drag along the length of the car so a plan was formed...





OEM sill cover with the return section removed - this normally attaches to the floor at a downward angle. The remainder of the sill cover is drilled along it's length to significantly reduce it's weight. This is the part that the "Euro kit" skirts will attach to





OEM sill cover (or what's left of it) now firmly attached to the car using all OEM mounting clips.





The "Euro Kit" side skirts are then simply placed over the top and secured at the ends in total with 3 screws. The plan is too finish the fitment off with a full flat return to the floor made of very thin aluminum, this will give the underside of the car a much flatter and smoother aero surface. This may also incorporate a verticle "drop lip" to channel airflow along the underside of the car. I've yet to finish this aspect but will update when done.








Simple one this, door and window rubbers and trim thoroughly cleaned and refitted.







Back to finding more stuff to make lighter and tidy up before they go back in the car. Bear in mind that as usual I am constantly looking at re-using as many of the original parts as I can but also to keep the weight as low as possible. This is still (despite what many people think) in no way a big budget open cheque book race car build. If the budget was huge enough I'm sure we'd all like to buy new light alloy parts here, carbon parts ther but hey this is reality...it's time to get creative.

With that said.... bring on the extremely time consuming madness


An unsuspecting innocent OEM handbrake lever assembly





Broken down into it's component parts





Mounting section reduced in weight by cutting back excess material. This would also have been drilled but the material is super hardened and seemingly impervious to any type of drill I have...even super hard spot weld drill barely marked the surface.





Thankfully the lever component was significantly less resistant so got the full on drill attack treatment.





The parts then painted, reassembled and refitted to the car.
You might wonder why it's mounted on raised "bosses", well if you remember this centre tunnel used to be multi skinned which in places was raised and included captive threaded nuts to enable items like the handbrake, gear linkage, centre consol etc all to be mounted. The handbrake bosses may be reduced in height again to reduce a little weight.









Ok so that was the handbrake done. So the next items on the agenda that I wanted to get bolted back in place were the two sections of pedal box - clutch pedal and mount plus brake/throttle pedals and mount. Trouble is they looked far to factory standard and very unfinished as they were. Also the alloy pedal which were attached although comfortable and great to use were not exactly fitted in the best way possible.







You can probably guess what's coming next.
Pedal assemblies were broken down to component parts and after some carefull marking out and consideration taken to how much material to remove and keep enough strength and durability.... some more time consuming madness continued.
Ultimately I think these could have been made lighter with more material removed but I have gone on the side of caution and am still happy with the resulting weight loss.
The alloy pedal retainers were also modified and welded in place so that they cannot move.

Clutch pedal and mounting after a bit of effort







Brake pedal and mounting after some more effort - You'll notice that less material was removed overall on the brake pedal than the clutch pedal. For obvious reasons I wanted to leave a bigger margin for safety on the brake.








The completed and painted assemblies ready to bolt back into the car.








Now that the pedal box was back in the car I could turn my attention to tidying up, cleaning and installing the brake servo, master cylinder and clutch master cylinder.
Although the brake cylinder is only a 15/16th item it always gave me great pedal feel with the Hi-Spec 4 pots so I decided to re-use it even though I have a 1in m/cyl spare. If I feel the need to change later down the line I can but for now I'll stick to what I know worked well.
After a small worry that I couldn't refit the servo and m/cyl assembly due to the strut brace mounts I found the only way to refit it was to break it down and fit the servo first before mounting the m/cyl. In the end this worked but clearance is tight !!










So there you have it, other than what I've just posted there has not been a huge amount of progress. There has been a number of other smaller preparations and modifications to the shell and some of the parts due to be bolted back on but I haven't bothered taking pics of these as they really are even less exciting than this lot I just posted.

Thanks as usual for taking an interest, hopefully the next installment won't be so long in the making and maybe a little more interesting.

Cheers
Rich

[Buzzonion Vtec]

COMMENTS

Rich this is great work the pedal parts look like sculptured works of art. the attention to detail is great i cant wait for the updates

Gobsmackingly good work!

[smilie=hate-hail.gif][smilie=hate-hail.gif][smilie=hate-hail.gif][smilie=hate-hail.gif][smilie=hate-hail.gif][smilie=hate-hail.gif][smilie=hate-hail.gif][smilie=hate-hail.gif][smilie=hate-hail.gif][smilie=hate-hail.gif][smilie=hate-hail.gif]

Your car is looking more and more like cheese everyday. You know the swiss cheese.



In fact you should make it look like cheese and race it. Like the dog car is Dumb and Dumber.

This is realy coming along now. Anything I could say would just be an understatement. This is by far the best build I have ever seen. Keep it up Rich

Good job Rich, just remember what i said about the "little unseen progress" bits, revel in the fact you've got them clean and tidily finished and what they'll be doing when you're haring round the track

Anyway, a word with you young man! when you use words like clearance, and tight, i expect there actually be some, "clearance" and have it be, "tight" - That's a bloody close fit right there, i'd use the term, "bracket" as it's so close that it may as well be
Joking aside, i bet you thought "phew, that was convenient"

Loving the holes you're drilling in everything, they're not even random buzzings with the drill, they look intentional Good job, though the pedal box certainly has a quality to it that Ratty already caught

Anyway, i hope you won't mind if i post up these pics i took when i was there, they show just how clean the car is and how much your attention to detail and dedication goes, now seems to be as good a time as any during the progress

Nice build, I want the colour of your engine bay on my car lol

Just out of interest do you think the cross member that holds the steering rack could be reduced? Just a plan I have, and need to know if it's viable

Traction bars are traction bars regardless of what you are using the car for, i wasnt questioning the "rose" Joints you used or the way you have used your rose joints,

i pointed out the angle that the traction bars connects to the front arm in relation to the LCA main Cross member pivot point.
they way you have the setup will cause "binding" with lateral movement in the suspension.

its all about axis and rotation

Don't think you need to worry about the whole "slow progress" thing mate. We'd all rather you took your time and do everything perfect, just as you're doing This is one of those posts that everyone looks forward to being updated... But much like christmas, it doesn't come around that often... But when it does!...

.

[Buzzonion Vtec]

REPLY


Thanks as usual for your support and kind words

Ratty has found my inspiration....shame it's harder work putting holes in cars than it is in cheese

Nice pics Dave and thanks for contributing them to the thread..I'm afraid my photography skills are limited to whatever megapixel magic is built into my phone
Totally agree with you about the little unseen bits...of which there are many that I haven't posted purely because they really wouldn't be of any great interest - stuff like several hours work reducing bolt lengths, cleaning up components yet to be refitted etc etc...it all adds up and needs to be done which of course is satisfying yet ultimately you have little to show for your efforts.
There is clearance there...but it is rather minimal...lol, we are talking thou and you may notice that the brace bolt required trimming right back to enable this "clearance". There will be the addition of a m/cyl brace which I need to make yet so there will be no risk of movement.


Ammo
I'll get you the actual paint code if you like but it aint particularly cheap...it's an Aston Martin colour
Steering rack cross member has been reduced in weight and seam welded already. Toyed with the idea of making a complete replacement but decided against it in the end. I will be revisiting this and perhaps reduce it's bulk some more but I'll not be going mad with it as it does take an awful lot of lateral load from the suspension.


Nathan
"Traction bars" are not all the same... the term is an americanised one anyway. I prefer radius rod and compression strut. Mine can be used as either with one end replaced. Angles of mounting points can alter the "traction bar" behaviour to your advantage if you know what you want from them
I'm not going to get drawn into this but lets just say that binding is 100% not going to be an issue...maybe you're not looking at the pics from the right perspective - and I'm happy with my knowledge of axis and rotation thankyou


As I've said previously somewhere in this thread, not everything you see during this build will be the definative final incarnation, that's what testing and development is all about. There are many plans for development items such as suspension arms, engines etc...all of which have to developed within the constraints of the MSA blue book and technical regulations for several race series that I intend to make the car eligible for. I wish this wasn't the case in some respects because then items such as subframes could be completely fabricated or indeed much of the front end could have been removed and space framed quite easily but hey, rules is rules and all you can do is stretch them a little

[Buzzonion Vtec]

COMMENTS

Sorry if you have already mentioned this, but i have read it, i just tend to not remember I did scan back though but couldn't see anything.

What are those white wheels? look awesome 18"?

How do you drill all those holes?

How are you going to seal the hole for the rear number plate? If i did that too my boot could i leave part of the skin, when the number plate recess attaches too?

What brake discs and pads do you use?

Cheers

Rich i got to say i love your car... its the best prelude and i REALLY think i can say that.. OK OK to be correct its the best modified prelude I've ever seen if you ever would sell i so would like to buy a piece of ART! i would get in debt to have your car and i hate owing money.. BUT OMG I LOVE IT... i sound like a girl lol

Wow Rich! This is really coming together nicely now. Your attention to detail is amazing, love the weight saving on the pedals assy and hand brake lever. Surely this will be one of the fastest 4G's ever created!!??

I love it!!! [smilie=hate-inlove.gif] [smilie=hate-inlove.gif] [smilie=hate-inlove.gif]

Is that a custom strut brace on one of the pics?? Looks cool and Rich cant you make it for everyone and grow the PA name. [smilie=hate-idea.gif]

[Buzzonion Vtec]

REPLY


jezzer101
I think you may have highlighted a need for me to compile a rolling spec list on page 1 along with and index perhaps?
But to answer your questions...

1) The white wheels are Rota Boost - 7.5x17 with ET45 offset.
The black wheels are Rota Sub Zero 7.5x17 with ET45 offset.
I also have a set of Team Dynamics Pro Race3 in white which I'm selling if you're interested
http://preludeuk.forumup.com/viewtopic. ... =preludeuk

2) The holes are drilled mostly with time, patience and a hint of lunacy
Power tools, Step drills and Hole saws help of course. Which you use depends on the thickness of the material.

3) The open hole in the bootlid will be sealed by a carbon fibre plate. This will allow fitment of number plate for when road use is intended and may also house the LED MSA rainlight although I'm keeping my options open at the moment which is why it hasn't been plated yet.
You can remove a fair bit of the extra bootlid skinning and leave that piece in tact but it is quite a thick piece. Remember though that removing the skins etc will mean you can no longer have it hinged or use the original latch mechanism.

4) The brakes are Hi-Spec Monster 4 calipers (the very first set ever on a 4th gen way back in April 2002) with Brembo/Hi Spec 325x30mm grooved discs and Pagid RS15 pads up front.
The rears have been OEM blanks and calipers with various grades of pad. Rear set up is to change for a plan I've been working on for a little while


STK
LOL, steady now
I think this Lude is turning into something that I can't see me ever selling TBH but hey I said that about the other cars I've built over the years so you never know. Start saving and I might be tempted


Salazar
Cheers for your comments mate
Whether or not it will be one of the fastest 4G's ever created I guess depends wholely on the definition of the word fast. There will be countless 4G's out there that will be faster accelerating or faster at the top end or definately faster on the road but my obvious aim is for it to be the fastest combined package of the above and cornering ability on the track.
Of course ultimately the true speed of the car will be the responsibility of the driver (ie Me) who will no doubt need to blow out some of his own cobwebs before getting back on the pace properly... it's been a while since me and this Lude were on track together but I am properly looking forward to the first tests for sure


Nitin
Cheers
I guess you mean the front brace? Yes it is custom and very light
The brace is made from T45 hollow tube steel and the mounts are welded directly to the shock towers so it wouldn't really be something that could be mass produced for a direct bolt on fit. TBH even if some bolt on mounts were made it would be too expensive for most compared to the cheap e-bay items even though it is probably 80% more rigid.

[Buzzonion Vtec]

COMMENTS

holly molly looks awsome man love it,how many holesaws u gone through ? would love to beable to do a job like that. do all those holes in everything not weeken the parts? are you going to bolt on the passenger door to save more weight? dread to think how much this would have cost a punter coming in to your place to have the work done must have so many man hours.looking forward 2 c the engine goodies

Nitin
Cheers
I guess you mean the front brace? Yes it is custom and very light
The brace is made from T45 hollow tube steel and the mounts are welded directly to the shock towers so it wouldn't really be something that could be mass produced for a direct bolt on fit. TBH even if some bolt on mounts were made it would be too expensive for most compared to the cheap e-bay items even though it is probably 80% more rigid.

yeah ebay braces are mega cheap, £20 or something, if you could produce one that you dont have to relocate the power steering fluid for price range maybe £50-£100 they would sell, I'd buy one

this car looks even better up close, work of art

I hope it kicks some ass, and gives preludes a rep they deserve

Love this prelude and post. Rich your doing a fantastic job on the car, its looking amazing. Cant wait to see it in the flesh. Keep it up mate.

Damn you!

I got the topic reply email and rushed here like an excited bloody kid on Christmas day cos I thought it was Richys latest update!!

+1

Get the next update!

+2

I was hoping some little elves had got on with it and posted an update.

Truth is the poor old girl has hardly been touched recently, have had too much customer work on in the workshop and too many Christmas parties to go to at weekends ....trust me...Sundays have not even been an option after the last 4 saturday nights

There is some background stuff going on in preparation but nothing worthy of updating just yet

Soon, we shall get back into it

This Sundays a write-off too

That should go without saying

.

[Buzzonion Vtec]

Update 14 – Originally Posted - Mon Feb 08, 2010 2:10 am

http://preludeuk.forumup.com/viewtopic. ... =preludeuk


Right then peoples, time for a little update me thinks

Yes I know it's been a little while since the last proper update and as usual I have a nice long list of excuses such as workshop/customer commitments, too much partying in December and an unfortunate bout of under enthusiasm after Christmas.
Never fear though...it's all good now and some progress has been made again.

It's pretty much all suspension related for this update and as usual I am only posting a selection of the pics, some of which I have grouped.



Some of you may find the following pictures disturbing


And once again, not all items are the definitive end of project final edit - there's a little bit of prototyping going on with much of this build and some parts are actually destroyed to find their limits so I'm starting to run out of my stash of spares


So, here we go then, first things first.
Heavily lowered Preludes suffer with quite bad bumpsteer....fact!
This is not something that feels dramatic on cars that retain the power steering but once it's gone and you have the car loaded up mid corner trust me you certainly notice it then! Before the car came off the road at the beginning of this project this was definately an area that I wanted to sort out and if I'm honest it was something that had been on my mind for a couple of years but I was just too lazy to get on and sort it out

The pic below shows a big part of the problem. Check out the static angle of the steering arm from the rack. Bear in mind that when the car is loaded up mid corner or riding over bumps then the angle will be increased further which in turn effectively shortens the arm and causes a change in toe for each given wheel. The closer to horizontal you can get the steering arm the less the effects on toe change over bumps will be. There are other parameters which contribute to bump steer but I'm just simplifying things a little here.




You'll notice that the track rod end mounts to the knuckle from above. The simple answer to the problem is to do a little surgery to the knuckle which will allow the track rod end to mount from the underside - remeber the track rod ends use a taper fitment so you cannot simply fit them the wrong way up.

Knuckle removed ready for surgery





OE taper drilled and reverse taper insert machined and pressed into place - note a lip was left of the original taper for the new insert to butt up to.







And voila, the track rod end can now be mounted from under the steering knuckle.





The other thing to consider is that as the track rod ends are handed with the wheel clearance bend in them (for when on lock) when turning the TRE over and mounting it from underneath you also need to swap side ie N/S TRE is flipped over and fitted to O/S.





Pictures showing the improved angle will come up later, in the meantime with all the suspension parts off the car there was work to be done.....

The cast suspension knuckles are obviously pretty weighty but they also take alot of punishment. Having said that they are cast very roughly and also have many areas casted for all model suitability such as abs mounts etc.

Here's a few pics of areas which could be improved on or removed





Plenty of time spent with the power tools left the knuckle a fair bit lighter and considerably better looking









Next I moved onto the hub spindle, again I didn't go too mad but definately able to save a little weight with this also. Studs have obviously been pressed out at this stage.





A couple of coats of paint and then the knuckles and spindles were rebuilt with new bearings and lower swivel joints.








Next up for attention were the heavy cast lower control arms (LCAs) and shock forks.
Actually before I get onto that I'll tell you something interesting about the shock forks while I'm at it. As we all know off the shelf Prelude track/race parts are nowhere near as common place as say ITR or Evo stuff. While looking at suspension options I toyed with the idea of running with ITR front and Evo rear which believe it or not would work pretty much right off with only a little modding to the rear LCA shock mount for the Evo fitment. One of the advantages for this setup is that ITR and Evo shock bodies are shorter to start with so less issues with dampers bottoming out.
Having measured stuff up I discovered that the ITR front shock forks are dimensionally the same apart from they are 10mm shorter - ideal for anybody whos shocks won't allow any further lowering or you just want the front end to drop 10mm more than what you currently have - be warned though...the "lightweight racecar for the road" ITR's shock fork are heavier than the Lude items !!

Here's a couple of comparison pics for future reference

http://img11.imageshack.us/i/dsc01197zsw.jpg/
http://img189.imageshack.us/i/dsc01196de.jpg/
http://img192.imageshack.us/i/dsc01195h.jpg/

In the end I didn't go down that route but just thought I'd share the info
Right, back to the LCAs and shock forks

Stock, rough, ugly and heavy





Smoothed, lightened and much more attractive








LCAs painted and fitted with new poly bushes - a job made easier by the fact that this set were poly bushed previously anyway.




So that's the knuckle, LCAs and shock forks done, lets compare the look and weight to stock OEM parts, both in fully built up form.






In case it's difficult to see in that pic the weights work out at - Stock=12.75kg vs modified=10.5kg.
Yep that's 2.25kg saved per side and more importantly it's unsprung weight - some is actually partially sprung but I'm not gonna nit pick lol



So time to get the new improved, lighter and prettier suspension back on the car. Compare and contrast with how it was, pay attention to the steering arm angle and track rod end position.
Oh and there's some new coilovers bolted on as well. A set of race spec XYZs that I've tested on my other Lude - A bit too hardcore for the very much under developed other Lude on track and way to over the top for road use (luckily they also do Super Sport kits for fast road/trackday stuff) but these should work well for the race car. I have also kept my previous coilover setup which were custom Dampertech items and are very much more softly sprung and damped. These will be refurbed and spring rates reduced a little for use as a quick swap "wet set up".

So...old vs new





And a closer look













Now you may have noticed I've not done anything with the front upper arm. Well actually I did swap out my modified upper arms and fitted some standard items I had kicking around. The modified arms was something I did several years ago to get me additional camber, I have some plans for them and for something else which you will find out about in due course

So for now that's the front end sorted. Time to move onto the back end of the car.

Here's how things looked to begin with, standard other than the dampertech coilovers and poly bushes.







I expect you've pretty much already guessed what's coming next and you are probably right but I think I'll just mention that initially I wasn't sure I'd be able to save as much weight at the back but when I started to look at things properly.... oh yeah...this stuff is properly over engineered !
Of course the same applied at the rear as the front end, lots of lumps of castings that were designed to be drilled and tapped for ABS cars plus over the top bracket mounts...get it all gone !










Handbrake cable brackets - 5th gen tin item left vs 4th gen cast item right. Proof indeed that the 4th gen Prelude was massively over engineered





Rear knuckle smoothed, lightened, painted and built back up with new lower swivel joint - Note light alloy fastners, reduced brake hose bracket and tin handbrake cable bracket.






Compare old OEM vs modified item






Stock rear upper wishbone or UCA as it's sometimes known. Although generally considered to be strong enough for road use I have had my doubts for some time over it's ability to resist twisting during hard use - you can in fact twist them relatively easily in your hands. Honda must have had the same doubts too as the later 5th gen received a hefty plate addition to beef up their arms.

So without wanting to resort to buying new 5th gen UCAs which are actually too far the other way...over engineered and much too heavy, I decided to make use of the 4th gen items I had and a little bit of structural work. The pic below goes from OEM arm, through the modifying process right through to painted, cleaned up inner joints and new poly bushes. Job done.





Rear trailing arms simply freshened up and fitted with new poly bushes.
I toyed with the idea of beefing these up a little with some bracing running down the "open" side but decided for the work they do there really would be no need to.






Rear LCAs next then. These things are heavy!! Much weightier and physically more beefy than the front LCAs. Properly over engineered and properly about to get some surgery !!









LCAs modified, painted and new poly bushes installed. Unfortunately I didn't have any black trailing arm mount bushes left so red it is.






So what was the weight saving? Unfortunately, unlike the front end whereby I had a 100% stock set of arms and knuckles to compare with I only had the one set of rear LCAs left after destroying a set through testing. So basically just had to compare bare unbushed arms.
Stock knuckle and LCA vs modified items - Stock= just under 10.5kg, modifed = a shade under 8kg - another 2.5kg gone per rear corner


Rear subframe - unfortunately, Honda in their infinite wisdom decided that camber adjustability on 2ws models wasn't necessary (yet the 4ws models have it as standard). Aftermarket camber bolts are not really an option for several reasons such as they have a slimmer size to allow for an offset cam section and are therefore weaker, they also would not give anywhere near enough camber adjustment that I required and also there is a captive nut on the subframe which would need to be removed to allow the use of these.

Only one thing to do then...modify it and make it adjustable with plenty of range using original sized bolts and eccentric camber plates similar to the OEM style on 4ws models...only more adjustment.
This is very much prototype 1 as whilest modifying this 2ws subframe I came up with an idea that I'd like to try with a 4ws subframe which will help overcome another issue that the suspension geometry suffers from at the rear. More of that at a later date.


Standard 2ws non adjustable





Subframe camber modification part 1 - cut slots, remove outer subframe lips, fabricate inner camber eccentric plates




Subframe camber modifcation part 2 - weld in reinforcement/extension plates to inner LCA mounting points, add camber eccentric outer plates, smooth of inner faces for bush housing and prep for paint.




Subframe camber modification part 3 - painting, fitting and testing - note increased size of camber eccentric over a standard round item. This gives far greater camber adjustment range - Perfect






Modified, painted and lighter rear suspension all bolted back up into place












A quick example of the amount of camber adjustment now available to me...much more scope than the factory 4ws camber adjusters and should be enough for full dry to full wet setup changes in very quick time. Also makes for a nice increase in the car's track width





And that's your lot for this update I'm afraid.
So I'll finish this post with a summary picture of all four corners




As mentioned earlier, the rear subframe I am still looking at another setup which I need to work on and investigate further. Plus There is more suspension arm related stuff going on behind the scenes so to speak. It may well even be that the arms that I've just finsihed modifying don't even make it to the end of the project but for now it was an excercise in finding how much could be saved vs making new arms vs costs. Nothing has been totally settled on yet but again many race series will not allow non OEM manufacturer suspension arms to be fitted etc so I always have to be aware of that.



As usual, thanks for showing an interest, feel free to post your comments or ask your questions

Rich

[Buzzonion Vtec]

COMMENTS

Im up because of toothache but reading this made it go away for a min.

You are probably the most tallented guy ever to lay hands on a lude! Is there anything you cant do? Just wish I had half the knowlage you have along with the time and money.

Sir you are an idol. [smilie=hate-hail.gif] and your lude is supreme [smilie=hate-cool.gif] [smilie=hate-cool.gif] [smilie=hate-drool.gif]

Love the teasing of the cover on that last pic

This is what my dream lude would be like, I would have to have an interior in it though

Cant wait to see the finished product, hope your taking it to the shows this year

You could be up there with some of the worlds best car builders. Watch out Foose and Coddington, rich is out to kick your ass!

That work is epic

i thought of drilling my LCA's but was worried about it being cast that was near 18 years old (casting methods then are no where near as good as they are today) so i was worried about fractures occuring and studden snapage....

thats mad you have saved near 10KGS, thats is just massive saving

the plate on the upper CA is a fantasic idea, i noticed the flex when i stood on my old ones but i dont think i need that on mine as mine wont see cornering G's like yours will

everything looks awesome

you have got me thinking now, ive got 3 more full prelude 4th gen suspension setups here so might do some testing.
Thumbs up all the Way Rich.... well impressed!

Wow....thats fantastic. 10kg for upsprung weight is huge. The cheese method works.

Damn. 10/10 for attention. Your not missing any component in this build.

As the others have said, that's crazy the amount of weight it shaved off. Looking like you can eat your dinner of it too!

Loving every update just like everyone else on here.

Gonna have to come up to your workshop soon and check it out in the flesh. Still got you in mind for the cambelt / manual tensioner bud but gonna fit the clutch and flywheel myself. But I'll PM you nearer the time.

Cheers,

Rob

best story in the world ever.....factamondo. this gonna be awesome. get a haynes prelude modifying book made up after this. il buy it. cant wait to see this in the flesh and racing.

nice

frank

Wow, Rich you really did bring back a great update having "gone to town" on the suspension geo

Very nice work indeed, i felt a little spark inside me as i read this, remembering work i did on mine. Only to have it extinguished as i realised your suspension has the detail given to it that i wanted on mine

Fantastic work as ever Rich, makes me wish i could pop down and chat again, or even help out. We'll see, it'd be great to come down and see things before i leave the country.

Fantastic work, keep it up, i'm seriously impressed and want to see the end of it, so no giving up or getting discouraged, you're really rolling.

Talk about 'The Power Of Drewms'!!

That is cracking work matey!!

OMG WOWWWW

Crikey Good work on the lude. Go on get it out for a race in the Nippon this year

OMG rich great work i would love my suspension to be as clean as that

another amazing update
keep up the good work

.

[Buzzonion Vtec]

REPLY



Wow !!! steady on peoples...there's almost a bit too much love in some of those posts

Seriously though, I'm glad you're still enjoying the updates when they happen and I really do appreciate your comments, feedback, questions and messages of support... sometimes I tell ya it's the guilt of not updating anything on here and keeping you waiting for a while that spurns me on to cover another bunch of work

I know I've mentioned this before (probably like a million times so far) but there are many things that I've done during this build that I'm still not 100% convinced are the right way to go or indeed are the definitive final incarnation of whatever part it might be. So don't be too dissapointed if at some points I might back track and re-do parts of the car that we all thought were done and dusted.
I'm in this for the long haul and just want it to be right when it's finished.

The rear subframe although fully working, certainly strong enough and certainly has the adjustment levels I wanted quite possibly will not stay that way for long. The rear toe arms do not have enough adjustment I know that, but likewise replacing the arms with straight tubular adjustable items will introduce bump steer at the rear. The only real answer is either fabricated bent tubular adjustable arms or relocation of the inner mount points. I have some ideas which I need to investigate further which I will obviously share with you guys once I have figured it out exactly.

I'm also not happy with the front and rear LCA angles at the current vehicle height. The car will eventually sit lower than it is now so the problem will increase. The simple solution would be to replace the lower ball joints with roll centre adjusting types but of course they are not available for the Prelude. Civic/Integra items use a smaller swivel so not a straight swap but could be do-able. I need to get some measurements from other roll centre adjuster ball joints designed for other manufacturers before making a decision on this.


Bri

I'm not convinced that Boyd or Foose will be overly worried about what some idiot is doing to a worthless piece of Jap crap but cheers for the big up
To be honest alot of what I'm doing is not really anything that most people couldn't do if they put their mind to it and spent a bit of time practicing with power tools and the biggest bonus is that much of this stuff is what I class as free performance. Other than the consumables (grinding discs, sanding belts etc) and a bit of rattle can paint it's all free. Obviously the cage build and paintwork wasn't exactly free but the aim is to build the rest of the car on as tight a budget as possible....trust me..I'm no millionare !! My mortgage gets paid and I have a few beers at the pub but my clothes are like 8 years old lol

Glad the update helped with the toothache, that along with ear ache and arc eye has to be the worst pain to suffer with.... even a kick in nads is no big deal as that's usually past in a few minutes

As for shows this year... who knows...my main aim is to get it up and running and ready to test for the start of September in time for the 10 year anniversary of my ownership of the old girl. I know it sounds a long way off but there is an awful lot of work to do yet



Nathan
Thanks for your kind comments, more so as I know that you are fully aware of what goes into producing stuff that is totally different to the norm. It's certainly not just a case of cutting stuff up or grinding stuff down, there is as much time that goes into the thinking about it as there is the actually doing as I'm sure you'll agree.

I have to say I originally shared the same concerns over the LCA castings as you did which is why I sacrificed 2 suspension arms in the name of research/testing/destruction. I wanted to examine the casting quality so I cut an arm in half crossways and then sliced it lengthways to check the integrity of the casting for imperfections etc. I know it's not exactly scientific or up there with fatigue testing with computer analysis but it satisfyed my curiosity enough for me to go ahead........ once I'd drilled one and put some force through it as well
The next stage may even involve junking the originals altogether in favour of tubular steel items but whether that will reduce weight further significantly or not remains to be seen.

With regards to the UCA plating - You noticed the weakness too then eh. Honda certainly did or they wouldn't have significantly uprated the 5th gen items. I'm in agreement that for your car's use it probably wouldn't benefit you from doing the rears but I suspent you may gain something from doing the fronts ...especially with the amount of power you will be trying to get the front end to transmit to the ground. Food for thought maybe? I plan to plate my original modified front UCAs but I am also planning and adjustable camber setup for the front which is why I haven't touched them just yet.

What's the score with your build now? Not seen any updates for a while (apart from your Civic of course). Is work getting in the way of progress?


Ratty
You knows it !! Cheese all the way. And you know what...I was more than happy with the weight loss but it's just dawned on me that the new coilovers are considerably lighter than the old ones as well....may need to do some calculations on that and get the scales out again


Rob
Cheers fella. I'm trying not to miss anything and tbh I do get a bit upset when I bolt something back on that I haven't modified in some way
No worries with the work stuff mate, just let me know when you want it sorted and I'll give you a guided tour of the project


Frank
LOL, not sure about the best story ever but one things for sure I'm not gonna let the story drift off to nothing with a stagnant end. There will be some less interesting updates along the way I'm sure but unlike "Lost" this will make sense and have a proper ending


Dave
Kind words indeed mate
It was a bit of a marathon update wasn't it....and I've just kind of realised that this reply is going the same way as well
The way I see it is that you guys are good enough to show an interest and get involved so the least I can do is give proper updates and responses to the feedback I'm given.
You know that you are more than welcome to "pop" back down whenever you like...I know it's not exactly local but you kinda owe it to yourself to get some enjoyment out of driving your Lude after all the work you put into it.
Don't worry, it will get finished... I am in a state of high motivation at the moment so things might move along a tad faster than of late.


Top Prelude and taz8520
Sorry I don't know your names but many thanks for the kind comments, they all help with the motivation


Pete
Cheers bud, you know how much I'd love it to be out for this season but that just aint gonna happen without rushing it and that I can assure really isn't going to happen !!
This year for building and testing, next year for skinning the competition alive
Perhaps then the EK9 boys won't be asking "Why a Prelude?" anymore


Mercutio and Mart
Cheers for your comments guys, having suspension that clean can only mean one thing though mate... the bloody thing isn't being used !!
In fairness, once it's built and used it won't look so super clean for long...yeah it's easier to keep things clean from a fresh start but I'll not be out there polishing my suspension after each meeting that's for sure .... I will however accept offers if people want to do it for me

Thanks
Rich

[Buzzonion Vtec]

COMMENTS

Pete
Cheers bud, you know how much I'd love it to be out for this season but that just aint gonna happen without rushing it and that I can assure really isn't going to happen !!
This year for building and testing, next year for skinning the competition alive
Perhaps then the EK9 boys won't be asking "Why a Prelude?" anymore

I didn't think you were going to get it out for the start of the season knowing the detail this going to just hoping to see it driven in anger at the last or last two couple of races of the season (e.g, testing). I guess the bench mark for yourself will be spanking it around Castle Coombe

Just read this thread from start to finish...simply amazing work!

Hi Rich got to say the car looks amazing, fantastic work, think ill be up yours sometime in the next few months ill send you a email.

Wow !!!

Top Prelude and taz8520
Sorry I don't know your names but many thanks for the kind comments, they all help with the motivation

Alex...No excuse now

Cheers guys including Alex


Pete
I kinda guessed that you didn't mean for me to get it done for the start of the season...no bloody chance of that !!
The aim is just to get it built and then some discreet testing come September/October time...wouldn't want to give away it's true pace to the competition for next year.....assuming of course it'll have some

Castle Combe is and always will be my benchmark testing ground. Every meaningful setup change over the years has been tested there, once proven at Combe I know it'll pretty much work anywhere else I take it ... plus I've got my own lap record to beat of course