Lude Generation

Im looking at changing the wheel on my UK 4th, which has cruise and 4ws, both of which I want to keep.
Been scouring the net, but does anyone know off hand which adapter would allow this? and also which other wheels (s2k civic etc) in the honda range would fit, if any?

Cheers chaps

EDIT: should have said its also got the airbag slightly unsure of whether I can disable that part of the system with out affecting anything else.

I was fortunate enough to buy an adpater that had already been modified. I can't remember what the previous owner had done to make to 'work' (must have been 5 or 6 years ago now).

They made a carbon fibre bracket with 2 buttons for the cruise control.

i'll try and dig out some piccy's

I know Ammo was lucky enough to find a steering wheel boss that had the CC bit, I've had no luck finding one myself

I think you have to get another boss and either add a spacer, or grind it down - can't remember which way - Been sooooo long.

I couldn't find any pictures either and HondaRevolation posts have all gone.

I think you have to add a notch to the boss to allow the 4ws to work (For the steering wheel angle sensor)

I picked up a boss years ago on ebay that had CC buttons incorporated into the centre horn button



You can just see the SET and RES buttons ether side of the H logo

Thanks good people of LG
It looks like there may be a few bosses that suit, so what are my options on the wheel?
I take it that will be decided by the boss?
And anyone know about the airbag side of things?

Disconnect the battery for a while before you attempt to take the airbag and wheel off.

I presume the airbag light will come on once a new wheel has been fitted? If it does, just take bulb out of the dash

I fitted my Mugen steering wheel onto my UKDM with 4WS & C/C still working. It was a bit of trial and error to get it right.

My wheel has the cruise control buttons on it. But the hub I managed to pickup also has the cruise control buttons on it! Kind of annoyingly, with my engine build, I've now dumped all of my cruise control! The only boss I know of that has the buttons on top (I.e. actually on the round section of the boss) like mine, is mine, which is made by HKB - from Japan, they're not cheap but would make an easier install.

As for installation, you will need to dump the cable reel thing behind which is for the SRS (airbag) cables, then you need to replace this with a contact rotating thing from a lude without an airbag and has C/C. This sorts out the wiring to my hub and out the other side. Beyond this was some modification to the wiring harness behind, The C/C wiring annoyingly goes into the SRS wiring loom - all grey wires. It sounds complicated but was fairly easy with the right parts.

I guess, if I had a replacement boss without the need for CC, I could offer you mine for a fair price if you get stuck. I'll only need the horn to wire up then.

I have a load of pics over on PUK in my profile thread, when I get 5 minutes I'll post em here for you to see what I did.

Oh and the 4WS doesn't need any modification, the notch for a sensor is in the 5th gen model only. The main steering angle sensor is within the indicator stalk unit.

Cheers,


Rob

Here's the posts from PUK, with some pics.

Hey all. Another little update.


Nearly there getting my steering wheels on and fully working bits.

The quest started when I got this badboy a while back:



Genuine Mugen SW2 steering wheel which has the centre pad with horn and cruise control buttons. Brand spanking new condition.

I’ve given up on finding a boss that will fit over the Preludes SRS cable reel (for airbag equipped ludes). This is a pic of the offending cable reel for those that havn’t been keeping up:



The definitive answer to fit a hub to this is to use a rare HKB boss, but the bad news is they’re around £150 to get ahold of for a SRS & cruise control equipped lude. But you are paying for class. You’ll have the cruise control buttons built into the boss and a resistor to fool the SRS system that the drivers one is still there. This way your passenger airbag will still work.

But screw that, aint got that much to burn. Sooooo…

I’ve had a boss sitting in my house for months now:





I picked it up from a scrapper along with a spare track day steering wheel. It just so happened to be one of the rare HKB bosses with the built in cruise control buttons, but for a non SRS equipped lude. This was my back up if I couldn’t source one for the SRS reel. But is now my saviour!

The steering wheel that came with it turnt out to be a Personal Neo Grinta wheel, leather with red stitching. It’s a little ropy around the edges but quite rare and sought after, ideal for track use and a little smaller too.
Here’s a pic of it:



So my next step was to retrofit a contact ring from a non-SRS equipped lude with cruise control. I picked up this badboy from good ole ebay:



Got it through the post and removed the contact ring. It was perfect. All three contacts for the horn and cruise control wires and the plug on the steering wheel side was perfect for both my Mugen steering wheel plug and the HKB boss controls plug. Sweet!

So thought I’d get them switched and all would be good. Turns out that the whole indicator stalk backing is different for the SRS equipped ludes. It has three mounting holes for the SRS cable reel like so, as opposed to the :



Contact Ring:



So I had to switch out the whole indicator stalk bit – which weirdly enough had slightly different markings for the actions on the stalks? Ripped out the old one and realised at this very annoying point that the Main steering angle sensor is attached to the stalk unit and my new one didn’t have one. On closer inspection the backs are similar and I could have drilled out the room needed to slide the sensor unit in as it’s only held on the other side with a circlip. But I figure let’s do it right and keep the spare for when I decide to remove my 4WS.

So for now I threw on the hub and track wheel (hands were too grubby for Mugeness! ) for the sake of it and see if it all goes together ok. All good and felt really weird with a smaller wheel. Here’s a couple of pics:







However I now have the SRS light on (inevitably), 4WS light on because no main steering sensor, and the whole point to it all both the horn and cruise control aren’t working just yet! Can you believe it!

So need to get another indicator stalk for a non-SRS lude with 4WS and cruise control. If anyone actually reads all my waffle and has got this far and knows anyone with one from a breaking lude, please PM me. Gonna go and search for one now.

The SRS bulb will be removed and light area blanked. My passenger airbag will be disabled with the connector for now. But hope to remove it and make a fibreglass/carbon copy of it to make blanking panels. This area can hide tuning bits for my P28 now, like a datalog cable and emulator.

As for the actual horn and cruise control, I need to make up a wire connection from the other side of the contact ring to the SRS main harness. You can see the existing ribbon cable here which is all a part of the SRS cable reel:




So nearly there. At least the Mugen wheel will be on for Japfest, even though a couple of lights may be on (unless I sort it all by then?).


SECOND POST

Next day I tackled my steering wheel issue again. I had my track day wheel on and the HKB boss on (see a page or two back if you don’t know what I’m talking about). But I had the wrong indicator stalk to mount the 4WS main angle sensor to and I needed to make a new harness from the new contact ring and SRS main harness for my horn and cruise control. So I had 4WS light on, SRS light on and no working horn or cruise. Not good.

First I tackled the horn and cruise. I made myself a little wiring diagram from the Mugen wheel through the contact ring to the rear connector of the ring. Then I identified the corresponding wires for horn (x1) and cruise (x2) on the SRS main harness from the manual. I ended up hacking up the plug connector/cable ribbon from the SRS cable reel like so:



Soldered some wires to the stripped back ribbon cable to some connectors and ended up with this:




Here it is installed:



I also tackled the 4WS issue by hacking up the indicator stalk to match the 4WS version. Found out there near identical just needed a larger opening which is already marked to be cut. Maybe Honda just stamped these out when they added 4WS to JDM BB1 models? Sensor slipped in a treat and is secured at the front with a circlip.

A quick test with a horn button and BEEP! The horn worked! Wehey!
So I got the Mugen wheel on and went for a drive to test the Cruise and 4WS. But some snaps of the wheel installed:








There’s a couple of sweaty palm marks on it. But don’t worry she’s all clean now, and mint as the day I got her.

The cruise control worked a treat and was nice to use the wheel as intended.
BUT…the 4WS light still did it’s ON/OFF thing the whole time driving, the same as it was doing with the sensor removed. So back to the drawing board on that one. Hoping it just needs resetting.


POST THREE

As for the 4WS:

Checked the manual and there wasn't actually a problem.

The fast flashes in between the 2 long flashes according to the manual indicate a switch between a sub and main CPU where codes are stored. It can store a certain number in both locations, especially when there are alot of codes, even if they are the same. It stores each and every one, each time the light comes on. Which in my case was alot during my visit to friends bodyshop and test driving the cruise control. So I can ignore the rave lights!

So a code 20 it is then which, funnily enough, is the Main Steering Angle Sensor. That'll be the little blighter that I removed for a couple of weeks then and just managed to retrofit into another indicator stalk unit. Also the sensor was perfectly aligned with the yellow mark when I removed it previously and reinstalled it.

Then I read a very important note:

'If the 4WS light comes on because of a temporary problem in the main steering angle sensor system, it cannot be cancelled by simply removing the cause of the problem and cycling the ignition switch; the CLOCK, RADIO (10 A) fuse must be removed.'

Basically any other fault, like for example I had a wheel sensor go a couple of years back. As soon as I swapped the sensor for a working one, I turnt the ignition on and the system creates a cycle that sees the problem is fixed and wipes the codes = no more lights. But for some reason Mr Honda made it so you have to reset the whole system to cancel any codes originating from the Main Steering Angles Sensor.

I had tried after I took the codes to restart the system by removing the main 4WS fuse. This obviously didn't work as now I'm looking at the wiring diagrams the main source of constant power with ignition off is the radio/clock 10A. TBH I don't know why they refer to it as the clock/radio fuse as it powers so much important equipment like this and the main ECU, etc.

So did this when I got home today and sorted!

Although when I got the car out the 4WS bulb blew.
Probably the rave lights in between codes wore it out.

But after pulling the clock/radio 10A, a quick check of the rear wheels in reverse confirmed all is well. I need to remove the SRS bulb now that the airbags are removed/disabled, so hopefully just swap it over.

I reinstalled the lower column trims and started cleaning ready for Saturday. I shampooed my EP3 seats, still needs another clean methinks to really bring out the colour. Then got all mats and interior vacuumed. Just leaves a thorough clean outside, I have some time free Thursday for that.

Some pics (crappy phone) :








Hope that helps ya bud.

Cheers,

Rob

Sorry Rob, I've only just noticed you posted this.
Thanks for all your info, very much appreciated, and indeed +reppage!